Did everyone watch the final episodes this week? What a dumb time to air the very last shows!!!!!!
HGTV is airing back to back episodes of Peter Falico in Home to Flip starting at 2pm I think it is and Sarah's House has back to back episodes on New Years Day.
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If she's smart, she's pulled it until spring season. By pulling it she can reset her price and the listing won't show the days it's already been on the market. it would be interesting to watch for a new listing to see if they had to change any of the interior (given what feedback they may have received) or if they just left it with furniture etc. still in place. One thing I noticed that I thought needed changing was the washer/dryer were installed backwards (yet another oversight that was just a head shaker to me). They just needed to be flipped around so the doors both didn't open to the middle but having that gas dryer means it would cost to do that.
that's interesting. I just assumed it sold. Maybe they are renting it out?
I asked my agent to check, an apparently Sarah's house was never sold but rather taken out of the market.
Does anyone remember the real estate agent used for the house?
Which is just west of the DVP between York Mills and Lawrence.
It's 61 Lacewood Crescent in Toronto.
Hi - I was interested in what city Sarah's house was in - I know they mentioned burbs but wasn't sure if south/north/east or west of toronto?
Peters house was very neutral even his paint colours. Sarah's was too other than some paint colours which would be easier enough to change.
i find peter focuses much more on the function of the house than sarah does. while sarah is an amazing designer, i feel that peter looked more at his house as an entire living space than sarah. also, peter's is definitely more neutral. while sarah's design is gorgeous, it might be too feminine for some people.
Arizona that sounds like a decent budget to me although when it comes to having a lot of work you want to do it can be a challenge. Guess that is why we are supposed to be taught patience. Heaven knows there aren't a lot of people around who can set the kind of limits we see on some shows. it would be nice, just not very realistic for a lot of us. I kind of laughed at Tommy on the show when he said he'd rather have $25,000 to spend on the tween room. Right, that's doable only for the rich and probably had most average folks rolling their eyes.
If this recession business does anything it may be to bring some of the renos we see back to earth as people just aren't going to be able to finance things the way they used to and are just going to have to get real again. Personally I love seeing how creative people can get when there are limits.
You will do okay with your house, you wait and see. You'll have to get creative with some things, forgo the 'whipped cream' (I love that phrase Buzzymumma's hubby had), because good taste has nothing to do with cost.
Thank you DBD for the Coles Notes version of my grade 12 Geography course :D
I had always thought this neighbourhood was a rural suburb but I suppose technically it is bedroom community.
Now it is all making sense to me why the house didn't sell! It was listed very much overpriced for the area and when they finally reduced the price so it was in keeping with the neighbourhood, it was too late as the market conditions had changed. Ok, now I get it.
Just to keep things in perspective the budget for my house renovations, the entire house, is $60,000. Trying to keep it to $50,000. So far the beer budget and low standards are working out. :laugh:
Arizona, the final show said she had budgeted $170,000 but went over by $60,000 so the house would have to sell for $906,000 I think to cover just the house cost (they didn't seem to add in Realtor or financing fees which my best guess would add another big chunk of change to the tune of $60,000+ depending on how she financed it and how long she had to hang on to it).
Janet I suppose it depends on the area/person when it comes to what things are commonly called. When it comes to burbs, it seems to come from the use of urban vs suburban with urban being downtown in feel to a lot of people yet anyone in a city can say they live urban technically. In my definition, suburban are the subdivisions built after the 50's (you can tell because they have crescents, ways, cul d'sacs, circles, places and other such streets that are not through streets). As the city grows around them and out more some people find what was once suburban goes inner city but to me, suburban is all about the design of the neighbourhood and the roads dictate that. Being close or far from the DT doesn't come into it much for me when I define suburban.
Older neighbourhoods (which tend to now be the inner city in large cities) were virtually each built like small towns with their own shops and such interspersed and being on foot kept in mind since cars weren't always even in the picture when they were built. At the time most places used a grid system to lay things out (some used a wheel but it still had a grid within it). People often worked in the area too so they were pretty much whole contained communities. Then it switched to this model where people moved to the suburbs and worked/shopped elsewhere and in some places they became large enough to be bedroom communities (meaning people only slept there mostly) and if they got bigger and further, satellite communities (but they were all built on that suburban model that came about after WWII when they had more people than houses so had to start building and fast).
Subdivisions (IMO) are just land that has been divided for development and has sub-divisions within them designated for different things be it the type of house or some residential, some commercial. AT the time anything is built it is a subdivision not matter when that was. What things are called probably has more to do with what locals get used to calling things than any real definition. Now with traffic, pollution, and time becoming more of an issue they are trying to swing a lot of cities back to having more businesses allowed in suburban areas so people can work, live, shop in one area so maybe those will have another name.
i always here this term used on here, "the burbs" i live in a small city and we have what we call living out of town, (outside city limits or in the country) or in town in what we call subdivisions which consist of old or newer streets. Now im confused. :confused:
I missed the part about the sewer clean outs so I don't know how that ended but I did catch the real esate agent saying that Sarah had to stick to her budget of $170,000 because houses in that area have a cap on how much they will sell for. I also caught that the renovations were going to take 4 months to complete which would have meant the house went on the market in the summer, June perhaps?
How much did she go over budget in the end?
Its definitely funny the different concepts of burbs! I live in East York. When it was built in the 50s, it was absolutely a suburb, built on farmland. Most people seem to think I live practically downtown now! To me the burbs are places you commute from - for TO that would be Markham, Richmond Hill, Pickering, Ajax & Whitby etc. If you get as far as Stouffville to the north or Oshawa to the east you are out of the burbs and into true "out of town". But I think the people who live right downtown consider Avenue and Lawrence to be the burbs, so like everything its all in the perspective. But I can definitely confirm the lack of farms anywhere between downtown and Don Mills!!
It was my understanding regarding the sewer clean outs that they had been moved elsewhere so they wouldn't be covered. I couldn't imagine that passing inspection being covered by carpet.
I thought she said she cut them down so the carpet could lie flat and capped them. I suppose we can always check tomorrow since they are showing the whole series of shows twice.
funny how there are different perceptions of what is "suburban". i live a few blocks from there and have never considered it the suburbs.
Not suburbs like Markham (where I work), but I live in Leslieville and that's the city - so where Sarah renovated is the suburbs as far as I'm concerned.
I believe the house sold. I had dinner with a friend on December 17 and mentioned the house to her. She was surprised that it was still for sale - she thought that $899K was a fair price point (I think she and I are in different income brackets :) ). Anyway, I tried to send her the ad the next day but I couldn't find it listed on MLS so I assumed it was sold. Sarah would have lost money even if she sold it at the price the agent quoted to her - when you add in realtor's fees, etc. she wasn't going to make money.
I'm looking forward to some of the new shows - Really Big Flip and so on.
The Donalda Golf Club area where Sarah's House is located, is IMO definitely the suburbs. No farms out there, because if there were it would be considered [I]rural.[/I] which it is not either. (I am sure Tommy was trying to be funny). The area between Don Mills Road and the DVP, south of the 401 and north of Lawrence Ave. is definitely an "outlying residential part" of Toronto, which is the definition of "suburb"....... with the centre of Toronto being around Yonge and Bloor.
I agree that if the house has not been sold Sarah's production company probably took it off the market for the holidays....and are hoping for a positive turn in real estate values.
If it didn't sell, it is possible that she suspended the listing due to the holidays and the poor economy. Only a realtor could confirm this fact. It is funny to me that the show emphasized that the house was in the suburbs. Well it was, back in the 1950's. Now it is pretty-much centrally located in Toronto - there are definately no farms around there - you could say that the only thing growing in that area is urban sprawl :)!
Thanks Cherylallismom for your insights.
It was my understanding regarding the sewer clean outs that they had been moved elsewhere so they wouldn't be covered. I couldn't imagine that passing inspection being covered by carpet. I could very well be wrong about that however.
I had also wondered about the timing because the house went up for sale prior to the show airing so early on buyers wouldn't have known either way about the construction or how much or how little she paid for anything. So I don't think that factors into it.
Personally I don't think it matters to most people if someone is a designer or decorator, they either like their work or they don't.
It just occured to me that this could be considered a tax write off too and saying she had to make the money back may have been done for dramatic effect.
Interesting. To me that house was burbs but your definition may be different than mine. Yours seems based on distance and I know some people think of 'inner city' as the distance to DT. The Real Estate folks in Calgary sure classify that way (so it goes by how far it is to DT vs how fast you can get there which can be a big difference depending on the roadways as here some of the far out area can get into DT much faster than some they consider 'inner city').
To me burbs are the neighbourhoods that came in about the same time as the baby boom and after (most visible as builds after the 50's). They fundamentally changed what neighbourhoods looked like. typically they have curved more winging roads, fewer 4 way intersections, no commercial (stores, gas stations and such) within the area as they were all kept to the main access roads. Basically it's when society changed to 'car' as the primary way of getting places. Typical inner city to me is streets on a grid system, stores etc. on corners within the area which allows for easier access on foot. They are walking districts whether it's for shopping or getting to DT.
I really noticed the difference between the two when walking my dog. With inner city I can change my route by the block just by turning a corner one way or another. In the burbs, once you get on some streets, you are absolutely committed to going the whole street before you can get off it unless there is some green space to cut across. here I can choose to stay on quiet, housed parts or go down a block to the stores and window shop a bit. If those are dull, I can cut over 4 blocks to some others. If I want to hit park, I can pick a hundred ways to get there either direct or by cruising the grid and can change my plan at any corner
The closest comparison I can think of using Toronto (since I haven't been there for a while and don't know all the areas) is the Beaches. It doesn't seem to matter where you are there, you are within walking distance of shops, restaurants, the beach, or residential and you could walk DT if you wanted or take public transportation. You could survive without a car in other words which is much harder in the burb areas because in most you can't even get groceries without the car.
As for backlash against flips, I think that holds in a lot of places and it comes from inexperienced flippers getting in there and doing a lot of gutting and upgrading when it wasn't necessary and certainly some aren't done properly. They often homogenize the house to something that could be found anywhere vs going with what sells. From what I have seen, homes that are restored vs revamped sell faster because there are a lot of people who want to do it their way or want a particular style of house so when someone else goes in and changes it too much it's no longer in the running other than for the niche that wants move in ready and then you have to hit their taste/colours or you lose them.
I watched it happen to some friends of mine who bought a gorgeous historic house in a great inner city neighbourhood. they weren't rookies but they hadn't flipped much either. they had big plans and money and went for it. What they didn't do was figure out who would buy before they started and went with what they 'thought' instead. So major reno/rebuild, high end everything, as they increased the size and lost the look/feel of the house. The house sat, and sat, and sat before it finally sold. They're dreams of big profit got killed I'm afraid. Had they kept it simple and gone with the type of buyer in the area, they would have saved about a year of work, a lot of money, and sold quickly for more profit.
Unfortunately for Sarah, they may have counted on her reputation too much if they emphasized the house using just her as the main selling point especially if there is a designer backlash in Toronto. For most people they need to feel they are getting the house they want over a 'name' associated with it so they'd have to have faith it was worth the price and that 'nicest house on the street' thing would be a big drawback for people who have purchased before and know better. There are also a lot of people who know Sarah is not a certified designer, she is a decorator, and they'd be looking for someone who they could be sure had the structural elements done properly. I also think her showing the reno didn't do her any favours when it came to selling. Just knowing the main sewer cleanouts were covered by carpet would be enough to send me away as I'd be wondering what other key components of the house had some goofy adaptation that could be problems. Now if Mike Holmes had done the house, that would be different as at least people would have faith the house itself and all it's workings were done right and the decor stuff could take care of itself but meanwhile, I'm not so sure I'd have that same confidence with the way Sarah did hers.
They showed her first episode last night and she stated clearly she had to make her money back. Doesn't appear that will happen at all because at the price it's at now, she's losing never mind the financing charges she may be having while she still holds it. Guess it's live and learn.
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Sarah's house was still for sale the week before xmas - at least the posting was still on mls. I haven't looked since then. It was still at 899, about 100k less than the original asking. It is definitely not in the burbs - maybe 15 mins to downtown T.O. at the most. If Tommy said he saw farms he was either joking or lying! (Its about 5 mins from me, so I know!) The neighborhood is quite good and the price, certainly the new price, is pretty bang on! Sarah definitely included all the labour and decorating costs (though probably not design services cost) in her numbers. In T.O. no ensuite is pretty common, though I don't know for sure about reno'd places in that neighborhood. You have to go to the true burbs (Pickering, Whitby etc) to get an ensuite in practically EVERY house. Most new builds in T.O. do put the ensuite's in, but an awful lot of places - even lots of million plus places - don't have them. Its not a must here by any means. Her house was definitely on the market in July, possibly earlier. I think the number one reason it did not sell was "designer backlash". The sense that because it was done by a TV designer it must have been terribly overpriced etc. Even if it was not. The agent promoted it heavily as being done by a famous designer, which may have worked strongly against it. The original listing even said "There will be no public open houses". However that didn't last long when it didn't sell fast! I even notice in Toronto there is often a bit of a backlash against flips sometimes. When a house is obviously done up for a flip and not actually lived in people get a bit worked up about paying for it because of the sense that a business person shouldn't be making a profit from you. The Falico house didn't get the kind of coverage that the Richardson place did (magazine and newspaper articles etc.), so he was insulated from the pall of celebrity that brought her sale down. And now the housing market has softened which is going to mean real trouble! The house is definitely not everyone's style - of course you can say that about any house - but those 60s backsplits really are very spacious and open and make great family homes! I hope it does sell and someone really enjoys it. (The furnishings are available for sale too, so if someone has a big mitt full of money they can buy all that too!) In the end it was still interesting to watch and I imagine the profit from the sale was just gravy for her anyway!
Sarah and Peter are my two preferate decorators.
Peter is simple Sarah see every details.
I cant write what I wand about that two houses, but there are many things to say.
I wonder if the house is sold yet.:)
With Sarah's house I would have, if there was room and you were able to, have preferred a double garage in the backyard rather than the pool. I would have then removed the car port or retrofitted it into a porch. But I am also of the camp that I would not buy a house with a pool - too many issues.
Peter did a great job with his flip. Selling within 7 days speaks volumes for his reno.
Did not care for Sarah's front landscaping. [U]Too many plants [/U]which hid the front facade. Could have achieved a better esthetic if they would have played it back a bit and saved some money.
Yes bylaws can be an issue that is for sure. So can the community rules hamper too. here our community has some say in what does and doesn't get approved. That would mean no snout houses which were also basically banned in the last community I was in too. That's great for me who doesn't like the things but not so good when people don't have a lot of options for attached garages.
I have a detached garage (as do most houses around here being an older area). I don't find it a big deal, just a bit more walk to shovel. The nice part is no huge driveway to shovel because the garage backs into the alley which is usually no big deal once a few cars or things like the garbage truck have been through.
Maybe it couldn't be converted to a garage what with new building bylaws, too close to the neighbouring property. I remember looking at a house where it didn't have a garage, there was room enough for one on the property but not to do it as per the by-laws so we didn't even bother going in to look at the house. That house took a long time to sell as I recall. It may have even been taken off the market.
This house has a double garage which is rare for the era but no inside access and boy do I miss indoor access. It's not the end of the world but it sure was a nice perk to have. If Sarah's House could have had the carport replaced with an attached garage she would have already had indoor access. You can't really store much in a carport and I'm sure a lawnmower would look out of place in the cabana by the pool.
Peter was lucky to have that double garage on his property when parking is a premium in the area he bought in apparently. Luckily Toronto doesn't get much snow so it wouldn't be too much of an effort to walk to the house. I'm not so sure that set up would work in Ottawa but i know there are a few older areas that have that arrangment.
I guess I am used to seeing that era of house because a lot of them have front doors that are off to the side or not fully visible from the front. To me it's about the same issue as it is with new snout houses which have the same issue but don't seem to bother a lot of people. It seems the emphasis with that 60's style was on windows and just the lines of the house itself unless they were the more traditional bungalow style so I'm not sure the front door would be a huge deal to people.
What struck me as a bigger problem that has been taken care of with a lot of that style was the car port. Most people now want an enclosed garage and they adapt the car port. The last neighbourhood I lived was that era/style and I had the only house left with a car port, the rest were gone. That, to me, would have been a much better place to spend some money than a pool because garages are pretty universal when it comes to buyers and they automatically add to the sell price.
Maybe the house was simply too quirky for many, like the front door, I had forgotten about that but again to me that wouldn't have been a deal breaker in itself but maybe with a few other off things it just didn't work for those who went to look at it.
I'm sure it wouldn't have been too difficult to address putting a front door at the front of the house, I wonder why she didn't do that?