that's spring clean all year round really.
As most of you know I am still in middle of the never ending story of getting my house (formerly owned by my parents) ready to sell and part of that has been clearing the accumulation of all of my mom's stuff. Well, with the help of a friend, we finally got it all sorted, gave away what could be given away, sold what could be sold, and what remained was the keeper stuff and junk.
I never really thought it would be a big deal to have it all just carted away and today that happened. Two full truckloads and nearly $800 later (and that was the cheapest quote I got) and finally it's all gone. Sheesh I thought they might be cheaper than hiring movers given they don't have to be careful, but I was wrong about that. Nice pay for 2.5 hours work (and that includes the trip to the dump).
I have to say it would have cost me half of that if I had been (or rather had my parent's been when they lived here) throwing stuff out on some sort of regular basis, not saving those pieces of wood, carpet, and such that might just come in handy. A whole lot of the stuff that got loaded in that truck could have gone in the regular garbage pick up over the past several years and I have learned a lesson that hopefully I won't have to learn again. Watching a whole storage area full of 8" pieces of wood, old tires, a box of peices of pipe go flying into the truck made me wonder why that stuff was still hanging around.
Sure is nice to have that stuff out of the way now and maybe this house will actually have the sign up front by this time next week (still some painting to finish and then the staging).
Just as an update, this house now has pretty much every closet organized and neat, new floors down, when I'm done, all new paint, most lights replaced, and half of my possessions already packed and stacked in boxes ready to move. It's sure nice to have someone around who likes to organize and knows how to do it because I have never had such an organzied house before.
I've definitly learned it's expensive not to throw stuff out on a regular basis.
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Maybe there's a happy medium? A FEW plastic containers, just in case? That was a very good idea about using them for paint...One of the Organizing 101 articles said to always put them in a box or carton inside the cupboard, as otherwise they spring out onto your head every time you open the door.
times i think have made a difference in how we live.....lives these days are so hectic and we are constantly on a rollercoaster, i think this is the one reason many of us have chosen to have less stuff around our homes....many seem to want a more serene enviroment. My grandmothers home and even my parents had far more stuff than i would keep, but i try to keep things simple just to free up minutes of the day. I do believe some seniors kept things as it was unheard of to be wasteful, unlike the world we live in today. Heavens my grandmother would have the same curtains for 30 years. I do believe there is many reasons why people hoard, and with some it is most certainly an illness. I also dont believe we pass everything on to our children....mom wasnt that organized but i am, i have children that love clutter, but i dont. Even kids are thier own individuals and will develop thier own likes and dislikes regardless how they were raised. My SIL is not a housekeeper by any means but her mother was so anal about how clean and tidy the house was, that is worked in reverse for her...
her husband does most of the cleaning
smiles
janetc
I'm with you I can't stand the pack rat my Mother was terrible and it got worse as she became more ill with alzheimers she saved everything. My Dad asked me to come and got through their stuff and clear it out. My Dad is blind so for him clutter is a hazard so I went and tossed so much stuff and my sibs were mad at me for doing it. They didn't want anything tossed but how many pictures does one really need. My Mom had pictures of so many people and we didn't know who they were and Dad couldn't help us I just tossed them. I now store all my pictures on the computer and on CD's so I don't have a bunch of junk around. We go through the house weekly and toss papers I never save a plastic container sorry but it gets out of hand so quickly. DH tosses more than I do so moving is going to be easy.
what a beautiful story....and how lucky you were to share those experiences with your grandmother...carry them close to your heart.
Now I don't want to begin to suppose what your love letters contain...I'm only happy for you that you didn't chuck them.
I have a portion of the letters that were written between my grandmother and grandfather during WWII. I have only the ones my grandfather wrote. They are so beautiful. I'm not sure that they would constitute as today's version of a love letter - but to me they are full of the love he had for her. He addresses her as "My darling ....." He reminds her to take care of herself and treat herself to a new hat. I started reading these letters out loud to my grandmother while she was dying. There are more than 100 and they only cover a few years. We cried and cried. It was wonderful to share that with her.
I had quite a scare with my health a while ago, and the doctor told me that I didn't have very long, and would be incompetent for most of it. Well, as you can imagine, that was quite a wake-up call. And one of the first things I did was roar through the house, even tho I was feeling like 5 lbs of dirt in a 1-lb bag, and throw out every last thing that I could not stand the idea of someone else finding after I was either (mentally) toast or dead. In the meantime I have kind of fought back from the brink, and now, although I am weak and very short of breath, I seem to be hanging in there, and should live long enough (decades and decades if I have anything to say about it) to prove the doctor wrong :D . And to increase the good news, my underwear drawer, my teatowel drawer, etc etc have only nice things in them. ;) I think it was clearing out my mother's stuff that gave me a total phobia about someone else going through my things. The only thing I held onto that I wouldn't want anyone else to see was my love letters from DH (sure am glad I didn't toss them out!!) But why would a person begrudge spending the money for nice things when they could still enjoy them?? Aren't we funny specimens?
You mentioning the margerine containers is making me get into some wishful thinking. I no longer have any of that sort of thing around and boy, with the painting I've been doing, would some of those be nice to have right now. I could just pour some paint into one, go do some trim, and then put the lid on until the second coat instead of using the trays and all that rigamaroll of cleaning up between coats.
Same thing with the rag bag. There isn't one in this house anymore and I gave away the sheets and stuff that would make more so I've been using a container of baby whipes while painting. Maybe not as environmentally friendly but I don't feel too bad about it.
It's funny though as I am used to years of painting in this house and just running downstairs to grab that sort of thing and now that it isn't here I am noticing.
You mentioned you mom being tight on the budget. Mine did that too and even with years of convincing it never really went away. Even her last couple of weeks in the hospital, I hired a worker to come in and tend to her for a few hours a day and she was still saying she couldn't afford it, shouldn't be spending money on that, etc. Gads, in palliative care, last days, and I'm giving her a talk on how it's 'raining right now', time to spend some of the money. I never could figure out when there would have been 'enough' money in the bank for her to want to spend some of it without worrying about it. It's too bad so many of that group never spent their money on themselves and never got over that fear.
was born in 1934, just before World War II; her mother died when she was 14, and as her father and brother were both working, she was in charge of the house - including the ration books!!
She still will not spend frivolously (?sp) and wandered around for about 4 years after dad retired saying "we can't afford too much, now" - well, she can !! My sister and I reckoned she had "tightened the belt" a notch or two too tight lol
But yes, I believe living through those experiences can last a lifetime - I still can't throw out old clothes myself without takiing the buttons off, the elasic, zippers anything useful - and if they might make good rags, they don't go, either !
DH's stepmother, on the other hand, has washed and saved every carton (margarine, yoghourt, ice cream, jam, peanut butter, meat trays etc. ) for as long as he remembers . . . thank goodness we don't have much contact . . .
I really don't know if there is much to do with age here when it comes to clutter or hording (being the clinical state). Certainly that generation who went through the depression wasn't so fast to throw out what they considered usable and often passed that to their children (of which I am one) but I think it goes further than that or it wouldn't be such a big problem now. Certainly the clinical state effects all ages as it is a chemical imbalance combined with some behaviourial stuff.
Really, the folks you see on Neat or those other declutter shows aren't of that generation. They are just stuck with their stuff. So part of it is being over consumers, part of it is being sentimental, part of it is rooted in issues that just haven't come up before (like knowing how to clean and sort, learning to throw out when bringing new stuff in).
Where the age factor does come in for many I believe is just the pure physical issues. Things that are too heavy to lift might get left in the house until 'sometime' when someone who can lift it is around.
There is a whole other group around too who just aren't about to toss things into the landfil that could be reused, recycled, etc. that is a really responsible attitude I think (as long as it doesn't use up more space than they have). That group certainly covers a lot of age groups.
I guess when it comes down to it it sure helps to know how to sort, know where to take things, and to be physically able (and have a vehicle that will take the load) to take it. the know how part was a piece I didn't have for sure and it took my freind dragging 3 boxes (toss, sell, keep) around with us to show me how to start getting through heeps of stuff. Then it was going through the 'keep' and her asking where I was going to put it and if there wasn't a place it had to go in one of the other boxes. That's a process I needed to learn (even though they show it on the programs, it never seemed to catch with me until now). Meanwhile, the only reason we could do a 'sell' box was that she likes having garage sales or I would have had to toss it all (the charities wouldn't take it).
One thing is for sure. I think the folks who are in business getting through people's homes (estate clearing) do a huge service for those left to try and figure it all out. I never want to have to do this again although I am sure I will be tossing even more once I move.
with my grandparents, whom I would consider pack rats, rather than hoarders. I know however, there were times that I would challenge my grandmother and she would talk about the depression and war years when you couldn't get things. She always kept string, elastics, milk bags and had a rag bag for cleaning. She found it particularly difficult to waste food and would wrap up even the smallest leftovers (think a few strands of cooked spaghetti). Despite this, their home was always pleasant and accomodating of guests. (They had excellent cupboard space). When they passed away, it was left in large part to me to sort through and this is something that I've been working on for over ten years now. Which isn't as bad as it sounds, as most of the stuff was subdivided or pitched in the first go-round. But there were many things that I just couldn't give away and which I go through, every time I move and re-assess. Just recently I threw an Oscar party and was able to incorporate into my decorating, fifty year old man's silk tuxedo scarf, kid gloves, gold high heeled dancing shoes and bow ties. All from my collection of "cool stuff". I also do scrapbooking and have come across loads of photos, including clippings of material used in making the wedding apparel for my greatgrandparents in 1913.
I guess what I'm saying is that there is a place for not simply tossing out everything and replacing it on an annual basis with the fads. However, good storage is key!
[url]http://www.flylady.net/[/url]
Like the acronym.....can't have anyone over syndrome ( CHAOS ). ;)
I browsed through a neat little book, have forgotten the title but the woman who wrote it has a website, if you google Flylady you will find it. Her topic was how to get rid of clutter on a fairly overall scale. Some of it was too regimented for me -- she had a schedule for cleaning each room and so forth. But a lot of what she said was so common-sense-ical -- like this stuff didn't appear all at once, and you are not going to get it to disappear all at once, either. The other funny part was she categorized some houses as CHAOS, standing for Can't Have Anyone Over Syndrome. I enjoyed skimming through it, and it helped me see how important it really is to think about your space -- do I really want to keep this, and if so, where?? In my case, I tend to more or less take the status quo for granted and it takes a lot (usually painting a room where you have to move everything out) to look at a particular space with fresh eyes...
Please from now on, keep the f^$@k out of my business ok? It seems you just come on here to attack me personally now, rather than contribute something to discussions. :rolleyes:
So because my parents and friends parents don't hoard, and I have a different view on this matter, I have no compassion? You know one thing you might have realized about me now, is that I speak my mind, and don't just say thing just to 'fit in' like you seem to do. Must be sad having to live your life like this, for the fear that people will fall out with you?
I hear about the pm's you send people here, when they tell you off, more or less begging them to not lash out at you. About me not having families in the UK, well......................I guess you must know, because you see things :rolleyes:
I would hate to think it's genetic, but I doubt that, otherwise these hoarders now will be passing it onto their kids :eek:
yes, that's exactly what i'm saying...but i don't think of it as an excuse more of a by product of behaviour. i've done alot of volunteer work with seniors and a good 90% of them have the same hoarding ability (disability).
no, i don't think it's genetics that's passing it on to kids, i think it's a learned behaviour that we've inherited....some of us fight the behavour and others give in to it.
Your posts are very insensitive for someone who has alleged to having relatives in England. I find it hard to believe you lived there and have no clue as to what those people went through and how awful it was for them. Anyone who lived there knows the lean times of the war and the depression in England.
They were starving for years and went without many things besides food. People who have suffered this trauma in their lives do hoard as it is a way to deal with it.
It makes one wonder if you even have a connection to the UK.
It must be nice to feel so superior.........
Compassion ? Well that obviously you missed out on too!!
Actually from reading your posts there is not a whole heck of a lot of good traits you have ever shown, is there ?
That's exactly how I felt with my mother's stuff (not the plastic containers, but the rest of it). It wasn't that I wanted it or wanted to find a place for it in my house, but I just had trouble figuring out where to start in getting rid of it. It really was overwhelming. Some of it that didn't take up any space I did save -- my mother worked in a munitions plant in the war and she saved the letters she received from her family and friends during that time -- they are interesting and nostalgic, I get them out and read them every once in a while. And some of her furniture and dishes I did want and still enjoy. But there was just so much else to send to the dump, give to charity, or do something else with. I sent a huge amount of quasi-good stuff to the auction barn. Didn't get much money for it, but it was the path of least resistance.
Nah...it doesn't make sense to me :confused: So you are saying because someone went thru depression, that is an excuse to hoard things in this day and age?
I would hate to think it's genetic, but I doubt that, otherwise these hoarders now will be passing it onto their kids :eek:
from what i've observed it seems to be the generation from the depression...they grew up having little to nothing and have suddenly come into such a disposable time...it probably just scares or overwhelms them and think the depression can hit anytime again...but unlike thier parents,,, they plan to be prepared....does that make sence?? i think what dustbunny is talking about is somewhat different....extreme cases of illness (saving their own feces?) not just pack ratting.
Am sure it's not the younger generations that hoard things, it's more like the older generations. Yes there are programmes out there like you mentioned, but a LOT of the old folks just like to keep stuff, don't know why, perhaps they think it will be worth a lot sometime :confused:
Say NO to clutter, not just in the basement, but people that block their hallways, over-crowd their livingrooms and kitchen with more stuff than should be in there.
There are sites around that describe it (I believer 'hording' is the actual term to describe it). I think there are 3 diagnosable levels, the worst being when a person will not even part with their 'body waste'...think Howard Hughes or those cat people you always hear about on the news with pet waste everywhere.
I wish I had bookmarked one site I saw. It had several people who posted pictures, what they were thinking etc. Just incredible, the mold, the pests, and just realizing there were people who could no longer get around in their homes at all (eat, sleep, etc. in one place in the house). It surprised me how many were ebay addicts too, often buying up just about anything they saw and had stacks of unopened boxes.
I can see how things can get out of hand. I am no neat freak by any stretch but figure I am never out of control range. Meanwhile, that changed with this house being full since I moved in 2 years ago (and I mean full, I could only open the door to the rumpus room, no way to walk in with all my mom's stuff and mine in there), then she died last summer and even more stuff came back. All I can say is it completely and totally overwhelming to me. I had just no idea of where to even start and often thought it would just be easier to leave a cigarette burning carelessly somewhere.
For me at least I had no issues with letting stuff go, it was just knowing where to start and luckily I had my friend helping me especially the past month. It must be really hard when you have emotional issues with parting with things and are surrounded by piles of it. The only thing I had to get over was thinking so much of the stuff was still useful and I gave it a try donating and such but in the past couple of weeks I can now understand why people just heave stuff, working or not, useable or not, there comes a point when it just has to go. I guess the people who would be in the hording league somehow can't get to that point.
it's really quite sad when you see these stories about hoarders. Based on the amount of tv programs out there now dealing with this sort of problem.....Clean Sweep.....Neat....etc it apparently is a more common problem than I would have thought. I came across an interesting website should anyone be interested....Organized Home.com they have a forum and all sorts of tips as far as cleaning and organizing. it seems like a great starting point for anyone dealing with clutter.
Today was such a beautiful day we turned off the furnace cranked open all the windows and dusted, dusted, dusted. I still have the window in the computer room open and can hear all the neighbour hood kids outside playing road hockey......hoooray spring is here! :D
does something snap in the mind or what....both my parents were pack rats. my mom collected buttons...she had old cookie tins stuffed with the things, every shape size colour you can imagine. dad collected everything..old tools, he had 3 trailers (?) bottles, jars and as he got older he liked kids trucks...something he lacked from his childhood? i don't know, but he must have had 70 when he died...oh, ya, he also collected music albums and had 4 stereos to play them on....ha ha...what was up with that?
this suddenly brings to mind one of the characters from a carol sheilds novel who collected her finger nail clippings....eeewww...
Extreme hoarding like you just described has got to be a mental problem. There was a man in our neighbourhood, not old and very nice to speak with, rather shy but gentlemanly and kind of sweet. He suddenly left the neighbourhood, even left his dog behind, and vanished off the face of the earth. We heard later that he had died several years after leaving here. So obviously there were problems that no one knew about. But the point of my story is, when they went into his house (I guess to make sure he wasn't still in there somewhere) it was full of newspapers and junk mail just like you described. He had such a bad mouse problem that he had brought home all these old fridges and they were in the kitchen (not plugged in), but he was using them as cupboards so the mice wouldn't eat his food. What a pitiful thing.
Pleased am I to say that my mother wasn't that bad, and nor am I (yet). You have touched on my deepest fear, tho' (becoming my mother). The other day I said to my cat, Are you making water spots on my clean floor? (O NO, I'm channeling your grandma, Gracie) :(
Well I see I am not alone in trying to clear out a lifetime's worth of stuff. My mom was actually a clean freak and it would be safe to say she wasn't sentimental about anything. For instance there is virtually no evidence of my brother's or my childhood left. It is all the other stuff though that could be used for something, someday when in reality just buying a new board or whatever would probably be a better solution than eating up space.
I wish she had been a little more sentimental. Practical stuff was kept (like the twist ties) but she threw out pictures (nothing makes me crazy like people throwing out old photos especially after having a family reunion and seeing things others had that we would never have seen). She nearly threw out a family bible (from the 1800's) and some other big time (in my mind) keepsakes which I was lucky enough to spot before they bit the dust. Those sorts of things I wouldn't mind having to deal with but stuff that can be replaced or that there was an overabundance of, well that could have gone long ago.
One thing the junk guys mentioned was just how often they have to clear loads of things like the small pieces of wood, stacks of containers and such that anyone who experienced the depression would save.
What did get me a bit was I had to pay recylcing fees...$10 each for every piece of electronics, there would have been extra charges for freezers or fridges, charges for tires, and $2.50/container of paint or chemicals. it makes me wonder what the incentive is for people to recycle if the dump/city charges like that. I understand why, but if they want people to recycle, having to pay for the privaledge is going to put a lot of people off. LUckily I can drop my paint off for free at the firestation because at those rates, I'd be paying close to $100 just for the stuff that was left over in the basement here. I have boxes full just waiting to be loaded in the car.
Anyway I thought I'd mention a real horror someone I know went through. When their dad died they entered a house they hadn't been allowed in for a number of years and discovered he was a horder. The yard has always been full but they didn't think he had taken it into the house. they were mistaken. He had a path in, a path to the bed and a path to the bathroom. In this tiny house (about 800 sq ft I think) he had completely jammed every space from the basement to the roof (they felt the stacks of newspapers in the basement were actually all the held the house up with all the weight in it). They called the dumpsters and it took a half dozen people a whole week to unload that house and they ended up having to pay for something like 15 tonnes of junk to be hauled. The unfortunate part was that of all of his hording, there was nothing really of value, nothing to resell or be reused that they could use to offset the cost of all that hauling.
Do you hear that saying. "I am becoming my mother." Oh, no!!!
Yep, my mother too heard the siren song of plastic containers -- bazillions of ice cream, sour cream, cream cheese tubs etc etc etc, nicely washed and mouldering away in her cupboards. She also saved dry cleaner bags (neatly folded), and empty paint pails. She was a painting fanatic, and painted like the entire interior of the house every spring (wish I had that much energy). So I think she didn't want to have to worry about disposing of the nearly-empty pails herself. Dozens of them. (by the same token, I pity the fool who has to clear out my garden shed some day, because I've got every plastic pot that I ever bought a plant in). :o
My mother is still in the save everything mode. Except the good stuff. She keeps empty boxes in case some one might need one. Every single prepackaged salad container is washed up and stored in the basement in case she takes a dish to someone's house. 5 ok, 50 ugh! You get the idea. She gave away a lot of the older, interesting furniture.
When DH's mother died he boxed up so much stuff - it's SENTIMENTAL. It's in boxes for heavan's sake. DH - it could be valuable some day. I swear it lost all the value it might have when we paid the shipping charges when we moved. I made him put out some of the stuff. We have a 45 record player in the basement that doesn't work anymore. He does keep everything very neat.
Now that I've grumbled about the excess stuff we have in storage I do have to admit that like pegsdilema I've tossed things that I regret. Oh I also just posted how I go to garage sales so maybe my kids will be cursing me some day too. :D
DBD - a number of years ago, we had just built a new house, and both of our parents decided to move at the same time out of area. So they cleaned out their basements and garages, and guess where it landed!!! DH is the pack rat in our house, and we got old batteries and old windows - you get the pictrue - I couldn't believe it when I found the stuff!!! We kept most of it for nearly 20 years before I could finally persuade DH that we really weren't going to use it.....when we moved. On the other hand, when I've got into 'cleaning mode', I've tossed some things that I've regretted, and have had to learn to think a bit. Kids' school stuff? Toys? Trophies? All boxed up and happily passed on to them to take care of themselves now that they're adults - our DIL loves digging through some of that!! So I guess memories are good to keep - old chunks of wood on the other hand - we moved into this house 2 years ago and already the garage......don't get me started, I may have to go out there and start tossing!LOL
I had to clean out my mother's house in 1993. She had lived there since 1947. OMG, the stuff. Every year she would ask for a nice warm flannelette nightgown for her October birthday, so she would have a cozy new one for the winter. There they all were, still in the plastic, in her closet. What the heck did she wear instead, I wonder. I took them home, but DH found them a little off-putting for some reason :o Off they went to the nearly new...
But at the height of my amazement at everything my mother packratted, what should I find but all my school stuff, still squirreled away in my old room. Why that was all still there, I don't know. Loads and loads up to the dump...
Anyway, there's something about spring that makes me want to get rid of my own excess stuff. I'm starting small (with a closet)...
thats a pretty good incentive dbd! My pack ratting skills are not quite as honed as others but I still love to collect stuff. Usually when I get bored with it I have a garage sale or if it is a larger piece of furniture or similar I'll put an add in the paper. I enjoy fixing things up so alot of my pack rat purchases go on 'lay away' at my house until I figure out what exactly to do with them:) It drives my dh nuts to see all of the things I drag home. I have more stuff than I have space but I truly enjoy fixing it up or waiting till the perfect creative use for it springs to mind. If the flavour changes I just sell it. I guess its not really a problem but if I were to state an incentive for spring cleaning it would have to be...getting rid of stuff to make room for more stuff!:D